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Re: USATF Officials comment on PV Helmets
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 2:14 pm
by rainbowgirl28
Tumbleweed wrote:The Simpson helmet is $99, so that means the USATF wants me to go out and buy another just to be in compliance!!
This is not USATF. The email is USATF officials commenting on some misinterpretations of an NCAA rule. The rule is only an NCAA rule at this point as far as I know.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:51 pm
by Decamouse
Truth and Fiction -- so much urban legend flying around - Simpson did not come out with a "new" helmet - it has been around - was looked at by ASTM before the ASTM published there std. The only ProTek helmet that now is ASTM labeled was an existing design that was tested. Does the Rule say required? Does it say required and must meet ASTM?
ASTM has standards on pits. They have a lot of standards.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:04 pm
by rainbowgirl28
Decamouse wrote:Truth and Fiction -- so much urban legend flying around - Simpson did not come out with a "new" helmet - it has been around - was looked at by ASTM before the ASTM published there std. The only ProTek helmet that now is ASTM labeled was an existing design that was tested. Does the Rule say required? Does it say required and must meet ASTM?
ASTM has standards on pits. They have a lot of standards.
The NCAA now says that IF a helmet is worn, it MUST meet the ASTM standard for PV Helmets. I personally think they should just leave it up to each school to enforce that. I don't see why the officials need to get involved at all.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:35 pm
by Decamouse
Not to be a pitpicker -- big difference between must meet and must be labeled -- really hard to enforce if must meet - which may be the desired effect
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:56 pm
by Vaultref
rainbowgirl28 wrote:Decamouse wrote:Truth and Fiction -- so much urban legend flying around - Simpson did not come out with a "new" helmet - it has been around - was looked at by ASTM before the ASTM published there std. The only ProTek helmet that now is ASTM labeled was an existing design that was tested. Does the Rule say required? Does it say required and must meet ASTM?
ASTM has standards on pits. They have a lot of standards.
The NCAA now says that IF a helmet is worn, it MUST meet the ASTM standard for PV Helmets. I personally think they should just leave it up to each school to enforce that. I don't see why the officials need to get involved at all.
Agreed and I'll add that I don't see anything written to date that says we officials will have to be involved.
While that could change over time (hint.. check the officials page at the NCAA web site from time to time),
I don't intend to do anything different until told to do so.
(edited add) Hmmm.. I just checked that NCAA site page.. I find no mention of any rule proposal that said the NCAA was saying anything regarding vault helmets. I find that very odd.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:13 pm
by drcurran
Vaultref - have to disagree. While I don't need another "job" to do while officiating the vault, if the rule says "if a helmet is worn it must have a ASTM label", then officials have to check to see that the label is in place. That is the way I read it anyway.
Dan
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:36 pm
by rainbowgirl28
Vaultref wrote:(edited add) Hmmm.. I just checked that NCAA site page.. I find no mention of any rule proposal that said the NCAA was saying anything regarding vault helmets. I find that very odd.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=22026
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 10:56 pm
by Vaultref
My reply to Dan never made it.. dumb computers.. not going to try to recreate it now.
Anyway, thanks Becca for the pointer to the Press Release.
As I think I said, my official source of information comes from the NCAA "Officials" page. Unless I have an old and obsolete link, there is no mention of the changes indicated in the press release. "Mr Pod" has been very good at keeping this information up to date. After all, its our main source of official interpretations.
The link I use is this:
http://www.ncaa.org/wps/portal/ncaahome ... CAA/Sports and Championship/Track and Field/Playing Rules/index.html
If there is a better one, someone please post it.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 11:31 pm
by Vaultref
Sorry to repost what was posted else where... but if these words become close to what a rule update will eventually read..
Track and Field
The Playing Rules Oversight Panel also approved a rules change in pole vault that requires schools to ensure that if a helmet is worn (helmets are permissive equipment), it must be specifically designed for pole vault competition and manufactured to comply with American Society for Testing and Materials standards.
Than in my opinion.. the onus is totally on the coaches NOT the officials.. i.e. "requires schools to" does not mean to me "require officials to". I'm off the hook.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:41 am
by master
Vaultref wrote:Sorry to repost what was posted else where... but if these words become close to what a rule update will eventually read..
Track and Field
The Playing Rules Oversight Panel also approved a rules change in pole vault that requires schools to ensure that if a helmet is worn (helmets are permissive equipment), it must be specifically designed for pole vault competition and manufactured to comply with American Society for Testing and Materials standards.
Than in my opinion.. the onus is totally on the coaches NOT the officials.. i.e. "requires schools to" does not mean to me "require officials to". I'm off the hook.
NOTE: red emphasis added by me.
If the ProTec helmet is as someone mentioned, a previously existing helmet, even though it was tested and passed the ASTM 2400 standard (I think that is the correct number), it wouldn't be acceptable. I only say this because there has been reference to the fact that lawyers often use little things like that in pursuing their lawsuit. (The ProTec helmet I checked today had both the 1447 and 2400 ASTM designation on a label inside the helmet. ASTM 1447 is for recreational bicycling or roller skating helmets.)
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:57 am
by rainbowgirl28
Keep in mind that that's not the actual rule, that's just from a press release discussing the rule.
Re: USATF Officials comment on NCAA PV Helmet Rule
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 4:33 pm
by Righteous Vaulter
http://www.ncaapublications.com/product ... s/TF12.pdfPage 42, Section 6, Article 6
Looks like helmets certified by the ASTM standard are only "recommended". Better print this out if you have vaulters wearing helmets, because an official will probably say something about it and you need to have proof of the rules.
Levi