Grip Height for Stiff Pole Jagodins

[KirkB]

Yeh ... what 3P0 said.

Kirk

[ADTF Academy]

After Page 3.5 I lost track of who was actually talking about what. Simple 2 ways to do drill

1. Low grip working on being symmetric you know taking off square and not falling out of the pit to the left side like you were....
2. High grip working on explosive takeoff you know figuring out roughly how far out you can take off and safely get into the pit....

Either way you should land straight so they do go together in a way.

Ok High school dudes that think you have an idea..... If you can't jump from 3 lefts, 5 feet over your standing grip with your body behind the pole, left leg extended in a jumping position, lead leg driving up then you have no right to discuss this issue. You need to listen, apply and reflect.

Rick Baggett
WSTC LLC

Are there really guys who can't grip at least 5 feet over their hand hold from 6 steps (3 lefts) and get in safely...... If you as a vaulter fall into this category you need to put the pole down and go workout or something. I would recommend jumping around trying to be athletic. Something like try to touch rim cause you have no explosion off the ground at all. If your a guy and have lets say a 7 foot reach and can't grip at least 12 feet with a stiff pole and rotate that pole into the pit safely you really need to face it your a 14' vaulter max for life.

PP nothing you create in your head technically will make you do this drill better cause I don't think you understand what will make you do this drill better. YOU NEED TO IMPROVE YOUR ATHLETICISM. The way your talking about this drill simply put you need to become a better athlete.

Way 1 is designed to help everyone be safe. Safe vaulters are happy vaulters...... Way 2 is designed to tell who are the athletes and who are not. If your a guy and can't grip over 13' on a stiff pole from 6 steps (3 lefts) don't expect to jump over 16' easily and/or with a model that looks like safe pole vaulting.

[kcvault]

Way 1 is designed to help everyone be safe. Safe vaulters are happy vaulters...... Way 2 is designed to tell who are the athletes and who are not. If your a guy and can't grip over 13' on a stiff pole from 6 steps (3 lefts) don't expect to jump over 16' easily and/or with a model that looks like safe pole vaulting.

PP is actually fairly athletic run's in the 11s in the 100m as a high school kid. The problem is not holding standing grip + 5 and getting into the pit it's holding standing grip + 5 and getting into the pit doing the drill right. I know for this drill the highest I can hold and do the drill right landing safely in the pit is standing grip + 5, but the highest I can hold and get into the pit safely is standing grip + 6. I have seen a guy who ran a 12.2 100m jump 17-3 on a 15-6 holding 14-9. You may not be able to be world class and you should always try to improve your athleticism but any male who can run faster then a 13 sec 100m can jump 16 ft with good technique. Also the guy I mentioned above is the safest jumper I have ever seen, you can still jump high being safe even with out much athleticism.

All though everything that should have been said in this thread should have not taken more then 2 or 3 posts. This is why one coach is often better then 10.

---Kasey

[baggettpv]

I don't see how 17' 3" is high. Would this be for High School, College, Open or Masters?
High school is pretty high,
College, nope
Open?
Masters yup!!

Rick Baggett
WSTC

[kcvault]

That is because your basing your info off elite vaulters. 17-3 got 9th at division 1 nationals last year. Comparing everyone to the elite will always make good marks look low. I would say 90% of vaulters cannot jump 17ft. You do not have to be an elite vaulter to be a good vaulter.

My point however was that my friend runs a 12.3 100m pp runs in the low 11s. PP does not need to vault dangerously to improve. With out gaining any more athleticism he can jump 6 feet higher just by improving his technique. An 11-6 vaulter is not going to jump 17-6 by improving there athleticism the main improvement must be in technique. Also my friend would not vault higher by vaulting more dangerously, he is able to vault fairly high without much athleticism because he understands the vault and knows how to jump safely. PP is faster then me as will and though I'm not the best jumper i would say 17-8 is a bit higher then 11-6. Athleticism helps but the number one factor in how high you jump is your technique. Not until your technique is perfect does you athleticism determine how high you jump.

If this was not true what would be the point of following one model of vaulting over the other. I remember reading an interview with bubka where he said even if you run in the 11s in the 100m you can still jump very high.

---Kasey

[vault3rb0y]

12' grip puts your grip at 11'4" with the box, plus a couple of inches for the sand-to-pit transfer. Man.... so i guess if you can't stiff vault 12' from 6-steps out you must be really un-athletic! my stiff-vault grip from 6-steps out maxes out around 12'2" in the pit and i am 5'9". Maybe i should put the pole down and start working out.... even though i managed to hold 14'6" and push to 16'10".

I can barely knick the rim, for what it's worth.

I'm not saying I am a super athletic person, but it would be a GROSS underestimate of abilities to say that because you can't grip 12' on a stiff vault, you are a 14'6" max for life. I take some offense to that, considering i am living proof you are greatly mistaken.

[dj]

hye

if you can grip 12 feet on your stiff pole Jagodin.. on the runway .. and can "hang" to vertical penetration....
from 6 steps... you should be a 16 foot vaulter.

dj

ps.. my statement is from experience...

[altius]

"If there are to be any responses to this I would like them to come from folk who have actually coached young athletes. Uninformed opinion is simply that - uninformed opinion."

[baggettpv]

Anybody ever see Peter McGinniss's graph of speed in relationship to cleared heighth?

Rick Baggett
WSTC

[baggettpv]

The graph will show that if the cleared heighth is greater than the average speed of similar performers then the best way to increase performance is to increase Speed. I had a vaulter that was similar to this so our focus was increase the speed. Thats the point I was making.
If your friend can get into the 9.3 to 10 meters/second range then his performance will be greatly enhanced.

Rick Baggett
WSTC

[kcvault]

I was wondering if there is a graph that show the correlation between jump height and vertical leap. Obviously speed is the most important factor but wouldn't jumping a ft higher at take off be the same as being a foot taller, along with allow you to roll the pole one foot closer to vertical?

---Kasey

[VaultPurple]

I think it would more have to do with running vertical or long jump. Vertical off two feet really does not have that much to do with anything but being explosive. But I am not sure how it works with the vault... But as far as jumping to be higher, the world record holder in high jump jumped over 8' but only had a vertical of 28 inches. But our long jumpers and short sprinters are around 40in.

I'm sure it couldn't hurt to have a good vertical....

But if you look at pole vaulters that take off really under compared to those that take off 'on' or 'free', I bet the vaulters with free take offs at the elite level have much better long jumps than the one's that are under. This is because if you take off 'on' and do not jump up any, you will squish the pole. Where if you take off under and do not jump, the pole will all ready have some tension in it and just pick you up.