Re: Let's talk about box collars!
Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 2:30 pm
Enough BS about what is a fact -- look in the meeting minutes from ASTM F08.67 from November 15, 2012 - there were negative votes because these members thought it "mandated the use of winged design" until it was clarified that "If the box collar has box collar wings" - this wording is in the minutes and this wording is still in the standard as published. How you can say they are required when this was specifically addressed and documented in the meeting minutes. It would not have passed until these negatives has been either shown to be non-persuasive or is withdrawn. F08 votes on this not just F08.67 (again look at the minutes).
For this wording to be removed it has to go back before F08 not just F08.67 --- go look on the ASTM website and read the meeting minutes
Now the NCAA can choose to say they want to have Box collars that meet the standard and must have the wings -- the standard is a minimum and allowed the use of wings - look at where this standard came from - the box collar was shown in F1162 and was included in that standard but it was felt it needed to be addressed because the secondary (supplementary) padding did not have any performance requirement. At this point wings woud not have been allowed. So if your reply is the minutes are wrong or we just said that so the negative votes would be withdrawn -- does not work that way -- "IF" was a delibrate word put in the standard - it does not say "must" - read the minutes
For this wording to be removed it has to go back before F08 not just F08.67 --- go look on the ASTM website and read the meeting minutes
Now the NCAA can choose to say they want to have Box collars that meet the standard and must have the wings -- the standard is a minimum and allowed the use of wings - look at where this standard came from - the box collar was shown in F1162 and was included in that standard but it was felt it needed to be addressed because the secondary (supplementary) padding did not have any performance requirement. At this point wings woud not have been allowed. So if your reply is the minutes are wrong or we just said that so the negative votes would be withdrawn -- does not work that way -- "IF" was a delibrate word put in the standard - it does not say "must" - read the minutes