Important: Latest News about labels

[AVC Coach]

Good solutions Kris and great points!

[belmore]

Lonestar pole vault, Kris Allison, on this message board, could have just made the rules sensible and fair for most competitors in the vault. The label rule, how high you can hold label, the inscribed or label rule, appears to be more a marketing tool than an actual safety issue. I have poles that have been recertified, purchased in 98, come back 15 pounds heavier, one came back from being a 11' 70 to a 150#. I do not want to ever see a vaulter injured, however, I don't want to see a youngster showing up to compete at a meet with a pole 10# below her weight on a sliding scale no one really understands gripping down to where she can't ever bend it stiff poling over 6 ft to place 3rd only to have it taken from her because she was disqualified while the pole she was using was made back in '76 and her dad cut it down for her so she could carry it. Years ago, Paul Richards dad, Bob Richards, two time Olympic champion in the vault, wrote in Track and Field News, maybe it was time to make the kids stiff vault, have 4 or 5 poles available at the competition, all unbendable, they compete with the same equipment. No labels, no different flexes, just vaulting. I thought he was crazy back then, now I wonder.

[CowtownPV]

I very much agree with Chris on this, I have never liked the wieght rule. At Texas Relays after my vaulter got off the scales I asked if they wanted to check his poles and they said "No, your signature guarantees he is on a safe pole". To me that was fine. The vaulter I had there was 112 pounds jumping on a 150 but back home I had a freshman girl who was 120 jumping on a 110 and both of them were on poles that were safe for them and the best pole for them to jump on. Since the rules are based on avoiding lawsuits and liabilty let the coach sign for the vaulters. At the start of every football game the referee asks the head coach "Are all you players equipped with all the necessary safety equipement as required by rule?" Once the coach says yes the liability is on him. Coaches with any brain at all would make sure they were coaching their kids to be on the right pole. You wouldn't have to require the coaches to take a class ,they would be looking for it, just to cover their own rear end. One thing though Chris, there might even be some old poor public school coaches who could help the club/college coaches teach the class.

[lonestar]

You wouldn't have to require the coaches to take a class ,they would be looking for it, just to cover their own rear end. One thing though Chris, there might even be some old poor public school coaches who could help the club/college coaches teach the class.

Very much agreed John! My bad for discounting the fact that there are a few good men (and women) public school coaches out there - y'all are few and far in between though!

[belmore]

No, Kris, there is a whole bunch of them out there, they just don't have the time to keep up with everything in the pole vault world while they coach several sports, teach a class, grade papers, counsel our youngsters. And squeeze in time for their families. I would hope the NFHSA would accept at least some of your ideals. At least get the yoke of an impending lawsuit off these coaches necks. Stick to your guns, get your word out there. Your plan can keep our young vaulters safe, not raise the expenses of this event and still have high bars and good competions. Even though, I am still liking Bob Richards plan of just letting 'em all just jump on the same pole.

[Vaultref]

(..snip..)
Welcome to New York - birthplace of the frivolous lawsuit. Yet another reason to live in Texas.

New York hardly has the corner on the lawsuit market..

You are maybe aware of a lawsuit in Texas where a football official ran into a coach who was in a restricted area and that coach was seriously injured? Yes? This hits close to home to me as I still work football and now in addition to have to worry about some player suing me, I have to worry about a coach suing me for his negligence?
Damn! makes me want to resign myself to the couch!


I think I read some of your comments in a subsequent post of yours, that make sense to me on addressing some of problems. They are good.. I hope you or your friend pursue them with the NFHS. But until any changes come about, I'm following the letter of the NFHS "law" no matter what.

[lonestar]

(..snip..)
Welcome to New York - birthplace of the frivolous lawsuit. Yet another reason to live in Texas.

New York hardly has the corner on the lawsuit market..

You are maybe aware of a lawsuit in Texas where a football official ran into a coach who was in a restricted area and that coach was seriously injured? Yes? This hits close to home to me as I still work football and now in addition to have to worry about some player suing me, I have to worry about a coach suing me for his negligence?
Damn! makes me want to resign myself to the couch!


I think I read some of your comments in a subsequent post of yours, that make sense to me on addressing some of problems. They are good.. I hope you or your friend pursue them with the NFHS. But until any changes come about, I'm following the letter of the NFHS "law" no matter what.

Not aware of that lawsuit, but idiots reside everywhere. It's a shame that many people can no longer accept responsibility for their mistakes so instead misuse the law to profit off of them. A crafty lawyer can make anyone look negligent. It happened to my father when someone broke into a locked up building on a construction site and accidentally cut off a few of his fingers on my Dad's table saw, which the idiot was not authorized nor given permission to operate. The kids hires a lawyer, the lawyer somehow miraculously proves my father's company negligent, and the little ******* costs my father's company six-figures. But that's a whole other problem!

I haven't the faintest idea of how to go about proposing a rule. Any suggestions? I'll be happy to write it up and submit it for review if I know who to submit it to.

[Vaultref]

[quote="lonestar]...
I haven't the faintest idea of how to go about proposing a rule. Any suggestions? I'll be happy to write it up and submit it for review if I know who to submit it to.[/quote]


There is a form that you need to fill out and submit to the NFHS. "Officials" have to send it through their state athletic office or at least they do here. Non-officials probably can send it directly to the NF, but I can't say for sure. Maybe Becca knows. You might contact a local track coach to find out additional details.

I have a softcopy of the form. If you would like it... send me a PM with an email address. There is not a lot of time remaining as they are due into the NFHS office by May 13th.

[H.I.S.]

Does anyone know where Pacer III's stand on this rule.
The rule says an etching cannot replace the manufacture label and the Pacer III label was embedded in the fiberglass. The official at the state meet in DIII in MI said this was not the manufacturer label. I argued this because as the rules defined the label as 3/4 in in contrasting color to the pole. This label clearly met that description but they said it was not allowed to be used because the label was not a sticker. I could not find the word sticker anywhere in the definition of label nor could the official show me when asked. If I'm wrong let me know why but I interpret the Pacer III poles to be legal

[rainbowgirl28]

Does anyone know where Pacer III's stand on this rule.
The rule says an etching cannot replace the manufacture label and the Pacer III label was embedded in the fiberglass. The official at the state meet in DIII in MI said this was not the manufacturer label. I argued this because as the rules defined the label as 3/4 in in contrasting color to the pole. This label clearly met that description but they said it was not allowed to be used because the label was not a sticker. I could not find the word sticker anywhere in the definition of label nor could the official show me when asked. If I'm wrong let me know why but I interpret the Pacer III poles to be legal

The weight rating on the embedded label is not 3/4", therefore you need to get a replacement label for it from Gill.

[ECvaulter30]

I have a question about an older Pacer III pole.. it has one of the cooked in labels under the a layer of the fiberglass but is it legal to use? i dont have the sticker label for it

[rainbowgirl28]

I have a question about an older Pacer III pole.. it has one of the cooked in labels under the a layer of the fiberglass but is it legal to use? i dont have the sticker label for it

No, because the numbers on that label are not 3/4" tall. You need to contact Gill to get a sticker, their contact info is at the beginning of this thread.