talented kid

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PoleVaultStipke
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PoleVaultStipke » Mon Jun 01, 2015 12:00 pm

I believe it was 80cm (all the way back) on this one.
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grandevaulter
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby grandevaulter » Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:07 pm

Stipke,

I've been dreaming of Belgian crepes and pastries.

If you are in fact still working at the PB technical model and would like feedback, here are my thoughts.

The approach and plant appear much smoother. He reaches way out with his right leg during the take off and then drops it only to roll it back up when his trail leg catches up, he moves it back up and in. When his trail leg does catch his right, he starts breaking his left leg at the knee before he breaks his hips. This appears to me to introduce passive energy phases and slows down his attempt to cover the pole and invert.

I have a boy that likes to pull his left leg in before he swings to the cord of the pole, and rarely breaks at the hips to swing long to the top of the pole. I would not give up on accomplishing these "key positions".

PoleVaultStipke
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PoleVaultStipke » Tue Jun 02, 2015 4:31 am

Hello Grande,

Well you should visit! ;)

These are good working points! I try to teach them to take-off with high knee and the heel under the buttom. Preferably untill they are completely inversed with the knee always leading the movement. The trail leg (left in this case) should be extended from take-off untill complete inversion. (i hope you read it the way i meant it)

What you point out about the hip is very interesting to me because i work on it but because you mention it, i see some flashes of other exercises where he tends to skip this part. I love how you can keep looking at the same things and keep gaining new ideas! This could also explain why he is having more difficulty to extend along the pole and is showing more "flag jumps" (i don't know if you know this term).

What exercises would you suggest? Maybe some work in the rings or short run-ups with landing on the buttom with correct knee and trail leg still extended.

Thanks for the feedback!
Steffen

grandevaulter
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby grandevaulter » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:29 am

PoleVaultStipke wrote:Well you should visit!

I would like that!

PoleVaultStipke wrote:What exercises would you suggest? Maybe some work in the rings or short run-ups with landing on the buttom with correct knee and trail leg still extended.

https://youtu.be/pIDWGPryS-Y
It is where Isenbayeva holds her left leg back that she connects her legs, hips and abdomen to whip to the next key position, "break at the hips". She never loses her right leg pike and it remains in an optimal position in order to keep the center of mass rotating up (not down or forward) and to roll the hips up when the trail leg catches up with it.

http://youtu.be/oVpPXPh8-pU shows the long whip and how the girl connects her hips to the whip leg when it catches up with the right piked leg as she contracts from the C position.

These drills performed correctly and repeatedly will correct Jule's mechanical order and lead to a powerful "whip swing" and lead him away from flagging at the top where his energy currently stalls out.

PVstudent
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PVstudent » Mon Jun 08, 2015 8:51 am

Hi PoleVaultStipke,

I have scrutinized your May 25th video and have put up a video with comments on YouTube as my response.

This video also shows exemplar vaults using the Petrov-Bubka and Renaud Lavillenie Technical Models to enable direct comparison to your Novice's Stage of Technical Development.

https://youtu.be/PyXv5KP4d2g

I recommend your novice vaulter learns some specific gymnastic type swing drills so that he can manage the transition into inversion and the spiral half-turn technique of the Petrov-Bubka Model of pole vault.

The gymnastic exercises are essential to teach this specific vaulter efficient swing technique and become capable of achieving full body inversion whilst suspended and swinging from both hand grip pivot points. In another post I will detail my recommendations re the specific gymnastic exercises I would recommend to help develop his pole vault inversion technical development.

The example exercises suggested by Grandevaulter are useful but do not fully address the developmental needs of this specific novice vaulter.
For example the Isinbayeva sandpit drill Grandevaulter referred to is not appropriate to teach the connection of phase 1 of pole support swing and achieve its uninterrupted continuation into inversion in time to maintain pole chord penetration towards the plane of the uprights and simultaneously exploit the recoil action of the pole.

The purpose of the drill being shown by Isinbayeva is reinforcement of the up spring at take-off at increasing grip lengths in order to maximize the total system COM and pole chord rotational initial velocity about the pole tip in the direction towards the plane of the cross bar during the first phase of pole support!

This take-off drill does not, IMHO, meet the needs of this novice vaulter at this time and stage of technical development. The drill runs a risk of retarding progress by reinforcing penetration at the expense of setting up a swing that will be capable of enabling this specific vaulter to achieve inversion swing completion!

The novice vaulter appears (video evidence) ready to make the transition to 1. A longer pole 2. Slightly higher grip length 3. Further “out” take-off with a greater amplitude of pole bend deflection to give him the space and time in which to fully invert.

I recommend you keep this “Novice” vaulting with the uprights on 80cms placement! Focus all jump efforts on rotating the pole chord to the vertical with maximum penetration and insist he lands well back towards the rear of the landing pads.

The pole vault specific exercise drills, I recommend you undertake immediately, are repetitions of short run take-offs into long swing to flat back landing towards the rear of the pads with both hands gripping the pole until the landing has been completed. (Jagodins to flat back landing drills!)

When this drill is mastered the novice should progress to long swing with half twist to flat front of the body landing whilst powerfully pushing and propelling the pole away from the top grip back towards the runway having released the lower grip during the whole body half turn just before the front landing on the padding occurs.

The long swings should emphasize that the trail leg swings at full straight leg length until it meets the extending lead leg with both legs becoming completely parallel to the line of the pole at completion of its recoil and at the time the half turn commences.

Note that the vaulter’s body must have a straight whole of body alignment (no arching!) in the long swings with and without turns when the landing on the pads occurs.

Long lever, large amplitude, high angular velocity trail leg swing power needs to be conditioned by repetition of technically correct performances of the long swing drills!

During warm up use pads for:

• Back roll extension drills.
• Handstand to front drop
• Backward roll through momentary handstand to front drop.
• Backward roll through fully extended handstand to front drop executing a half turn to flat back landing just before landing in the front drop position
• Handstand “Courbette” (Donkey Kick) to straight leg landing
• Handstand Courbette on to two feet landing and immediate straight leg back roll to front drop
• Step forward with the lead leg and swing trail leg through to double straight leg drop kick to back landing on the pad. (Double leg drop kick as in Martial Arts! The novices love this one but make sure there is plenty of space so that there is no possibility of making contact with anyone else).

Grass area:

• Cartwheels
• Round – off
• Hand walking
• Headstand push up to handstand
• Head stand and from straight leg flexed hips headstand position, with both legs held tight and straight, swing them upwards whilst pushing the whole body up into the handstand.(Excellent drill for shoulder and hip musculo-skeletal coordination development via the abdomen, spine and pelvic girdle connections).

All these activities are familiarization exercises that demand propulsion into and momentary support in and exit from inverted whole body postural alignment.

These exercise are also creating inversion specific kinaesthetic awareness. The exercises above, provide excellent physical preparation for the specific gymnastics swinging activities related to pole vault which I will address in a follow up post on this thread.
Last edited by PVstudent on Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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grandevaulter
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby grandevaulter » Mon Jun 08, 2015 2:53 pm

PVstudent wrote:The example exercises suggested by Grandevaulter are useful but do not fully address the developmental needs of this specific novice vaulter.
For example the Isinbayeva sandpit drill Grandevaulter referred to is not appropriate to teach the connection of phase 1 of pole support swing and achieve its uninterrupted continuation into inversion in time to maintain pole chord penetration towards the plane of the uprights and simultaneously exploit the recoil action of the pole.


If we move the youtube film ahead to 1:40 we see Jules reach way out with his right (lead) leg. He continues to reach and seems to work more on advancing it than any other part of his jump. His left trail leg does not whip but moves passively forward, breaks at the knee and not at the hips. When one or more of the key positions are not achieved or are not assembled in order, the technical model is broken.

It is my belief that the Isenbayeva sand pit drill will help this youngster achieve the takeoff position solidly. If he can't hold this key position longer he will not be able to powerfully whip kick the left leg and control the right lead leg to a position that aids in his rotation and does not advance his com. If he does become proficient at performing the sand pit drill, he will certainly be able to move on to the next sets of drills that PVstudent has prescribed.

The chain of energy must not be broken, all key positions must be met in order.

PVstudent
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PVstudent » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:10 pm

The video below examines the Petrov – Bubka Model Inversion Technique.

Angular momentum transfer is produced by the rapid sequential deceleration of body segments in a kinetically linked chain proceeding in order legs followed by hips then pelvis and lumbar spine terminating at the shoulder joint axis.

When the segments are decelerated (“Blocked”) in the correct spatio – temporal and graded effort sequence the vaulter’s whole body rotates as a single unit about the transvers shoulder joint axis.

This requires the learning of a connected series of muscle synergistic actions.

Failure to acquire the sequential co - ordinated movement pattern proceeding in the distal (legs) to proximal (shoulders) order and direction usually produces:

1. Poor trail leg swing power and amplitude

2. Pulling of the whole body upwards towards the hand grips on the pole by means of arm flexion effort against the recoil of the pole

3. Excessive joint flexion at both the trail and lead leg hip joints

4. Minimal trunk to arm rotation at the shoulder joint axis.

https://youtu.be/flqvZ6GzMDg

I hope the video dispels the notion that I condemn sand pit vaulting drills. However it is important that coaches identify and evaluate the specificity with which any drill (training / exercise) meet the needs of the particular individual vaulter with respect to age, experience, aptitude and current technique developmental stage.

The novice vaulter in question is having considerable success with a"dead end inversion technique" regardless of whether he is trying to follow a Lavillenie or Petrov - Buka technical model.

Unless this is changed as soon as possible the young vaulter in question risks having his ultimate pole vault achievements severely curtailed.

The video is intended as a guide to coaches to be specific in adopting and adapting pole vault drills. There are a plethora of potentially useful drills this young novice's coach can use.

Stipke, hope you find something useful in the video and the Beginner to Bubka and Isinbayeva too (2nd edition) references.

I hope the video identifies the critical movement elements that leads to connecting the leg swing of phase 1 of pole support into a completed inversion early in phase 2 that can fully exploit the pole recoil.
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PoleVaultStipke
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PoleVaultStipke » Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:31 am

Hi guys!

A little video update.

Below are 2 videos of him jumping 3m61 last weekend with a 3m70 - 130 pound pacer with grip at the back. I feel he has made some progression but i would love to hear what you guys think.

https://youtu.be/Xob9D4nUZhI
https://youtu.be/N4NYHtVhZnA


Best regards,
Steffen
Greatness is build one step at a time!

grandevaulter
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby grandevaulter » Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:46 am

PVstudent wrote:The novice vaulter in question is having considerable success with a"dead end inversion technique" regardless of whether he is trying to follow a Lavillenie or Petrov - Buka technical model.


If he/you want to get on longer heavier poles, he must use the trail leg more efficiently. Pulls it in too soon. If you read PVstudents last post on this subject, he spells out how to achieve this. Long swing drills. I have a 16 year old that is finally ready to listen, apply and take the steps to correct the same problem.

charlie
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby charlie » Tue Sep 29, 2015 10:20 pm

Great plant and technique! He needs to PRESS up harder with his left hand as he leaves the ground so he can load a bigger pole with a higher grip!!!!! Every thing else he does well!!!

PoleVaultStipke
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Re: talented kid

Unread postby PoleVaultStipke » Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:31 am

@grandevaulter

I fully agree but I see improvement. I am trying to get him more into the gymnastics room for swings on rope, high bar and rings. If he manages to keep his swing with straight leg longer, his hip will be in a better position upon extention. However, great execution at this age already.

How do you feel about the run up? I don't like the pre-run so we will be throwing that out. Starting on 16-step running drills on the run-way away from the pit this winter.

How do you feel about the plant? A tiny bit too late and I'd like to see more extention upon contact. Also taking off a bit under on this jump. Luckily he opens up his shoulders nicely so that doesn't effect him too much.

@Charlie

I am trying to keep him calm. If I turn my head he will grip ANY pole at the end without flinching ;) Pressing both hands up is a working point indeed.


Thanks guys! Any more thoughts are always welcome
Greatness is build one step at a time!

grandevaulter
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Location: South West, MI

Re: talented kid

Unread postby grandevaulter » Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:33 pm

Steffen,

This is a kid that I've been working with to whip kick and swing. Using the information on PVstudents post to you, we've made progress. We're still working on continuing the top end. He lets his left arm get in the way and typically looks at the bar. He stops his swing at that point. Last spring he was achieving free takeoff when practicing run and plants on the track. Feel free to give me your opinion. https://youtu.be/14wg1sR5ziw

Georg


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